Timeline for Is there a course that teaches the feminine form first?
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
15 events
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| Aug 30, 2021 at 9:24 | comment | added | Brandin | In the book I'm using, the word la maîtresse was introduced before le maître. For other pairs, the masculine-feminine were presented in the opposite order, or together simulatneously. If listing words simultaneously, as in a list or in a dictionary, it seems to be standard style to list the masculine form first. Such a style rule doesn't mean that the writer is giving some kind of preference to masculine professions or nouns. | |
| Dec 5, 2016 at 4:12 | answer | added | Robert Columbia♦ | timeline score: 6 | |
| Dec 4, 2016 at 17:35 | comment | added | Chill2Macht | Also for courses for languages like German for which the feminine forms aren't even derived from the masculine ones for almost any type of grammatical object (except for Student/Studentin, but that's an anomaly) there really is no excuse. I guess one could say that numerically there are more masculine German nouns than feminine ones, but it's something only like 40% to 30% plus doesn't account for the frequency of use of the nouns (e.g. most of the most important noun-generating suffixes are feminine). But even for German I'm not aware of any such courses, although there should be. | |
| Dec 4, 2016 at 17:19 | comment | added | Chill2Macht | remove a suffix -- honestly I am not sure there is any reason why that should or shouldn't be true. And if there isn't any reason why removing suffixes is harder to learn than adding suffixes, the arguments against beginning with the feminine forms of derived nouns and past tense verbs go up in smoke. (Note: when I say nouns I only mean derived ones, like медведица , not generic/general ones like лампа which are not derived from any masculine form) | |
| Dec 4, 2016 at 17:17 | comment | added | Chill2Macht | the change in the feminine forms of adjectives for accusative mirrors the declension pattern of feminine nouns in the accusative and thus is arguably easier to learn. (ie masculine nouns don't generally don't end with ы or й or ый in the accusative, but feminine nouns do generally end in у). Also in the remaining cases the declension of feminine adjectives is much easier, hence it can be beneficial to learn first. So I think there is a good argument for beginning with the feminine form for adjectives in Russian. Of course, all of this assumes that it is easier to learn to add a suffix than to | |
| Dec 4, 2016 at 17:12 | comment | added | Chill2Macht | I think this is a good question and a fair criticism of most language courses which don't even consider this or ever mix up the order. For Russian, I agree with others who say that this is probably pedagogically unwise for nouns and past tense verbs, because in those instances the feminine forms are clearly derived from the masculine forms from suffixation. However, this is not true for the adjectives nor for the pronouns which decline like adjectives, and the feminine versions of those decline more in the inanimate accusative than the masculine or neutral forms which don't change. Moreover, | |
| Dec 4, 2016 at 15:54 | answer | added | michau | timeline score: 5 | |
| Dec 4, 2016 at 0:03 | comment | added | Charlotte SL | @fi12 I understand a lot of good reasons why the masculine form is taught first - it has always been done that way, plurals are often based on it, consistency is important etc. I'm just wondering if it should be done this way and if it can be done in a different way. I can't be the first person to wonder about this, can I? | |
| Dec 3, 2016 at 23:55 | history | edited | Charlotte SL | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
expanded my example
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| Dec 3, 2016 at 23:54 | comment | added | Charlotte SL | @michau, no that's not true. You don't learn them at the same time - just in the same space of time. You learn them right after one another. I'd like a course that says "студентка" and then teaches "студент". The male form usually comes first, and in many cases because it is the "default" form. The feminine is the "aberration". | |
| Dec 3, 2016 at 23:50 | comment | added | Charlotte SL | @fi12 Actually, I'd just like a course that takes a different approach. Every course starts with the masculine and then the feminine. Why not do it the other way around? I'd love for it to be specifically about Russian, since that is what I'm learning right now, but I realize how unusual my request is, so that's why I'd love to know if anyone anywhere has done it. | |
| Dec 3, 2016 at 7:47 | comment | added | michau | As far as I know, the -ка suffix can be used with a great number of nouns. So it can be argued that no matter if it's the masculine or the feminine form that you encounter, you learn both at the same time, as the differences are quite regular. | |
| Dec 2, 2016 at 22:19 | comment | added | fi12 | Is there a particular reason you'd prefer to learn the feminine form first? Also, for what language specifically do you want resources for? Russian? | |
| Dec 2, 2016 at 21:16 | comment | added | Tsundoku♦ | Welcome back on LLSE and thanks for the original question. | |
| Dec 2, 2016 at 20:58 | history | asked | Charlotte SL | CC BY-SA 3.0 |